IN OR OUT

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The Fenman
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IN OR OUT

Post by The Fenman » Wed May 25, 2016 5:48 pm

I normally have zero interest in polotics.

Keep it nice tho please we are not the betfair forum x-) x-)

Im an outer at the mo two reasons . . .Cant stick The eastern europeans spitting and pissing in my streets x-) x-) x-) x-) 0^ 0^ 0^ 0^ and without them here the wages in my trade would surely rise.
Keep doing right things, right things happen. . . Simple innit

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Col
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by Col » Wed May 25, 2016 6:00 pm

My post from the any other sports forum on Saturday 21st.
Col wrote:Having just just ventured onto the market at the fair, I was quite surprised at the odds.
I'm seeing campaigns to leave all over the place, so to see remain a heavy odds on was a bit of a shock.

I had just presumed that with all this support to protect our borders, most people wanted to get out.

I've laid the remain in EU at 1.27
It seems that the betting markets think it's a foregone conclusion that we will be staying in.
Maybe I'm mixing in the wrong circles, but I'll be voting out, and nobody I know has voiced an opinion to stay in.

It's a conspiracy dammit.

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harry_rag
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by harry_rag » Wed May 25, 2016 6:11 pm

"Leave" has been drifting like a barge ever since I noticed the market (always seems to be on the front page when I look at Oddschecker on my phone). 9/2 now, I'm sure it was 3/1 at most when I first saw it.

If I was going to both assume the market has got it right and generalise wildly I'd say the silent majority who intend to vote "stay" are keeping quiet to avoid arguments with the more vocal and racist fringe of the "leave" brigade.

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not suggesting everyone who thinks we should leave is a shouty racist, just that most shouty racists will probably be firm advocates of the "Brexit" (as I hate hearing it called).

Not sure if I'll be voting yet, especially as I haven't had a bet on the outcome! ;-)

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peanut
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by peanut » Wed May 25, 2016 6:16 pm

Definitely OUT please, the list would be long but one or two at the top are :

How can we be ruled by an unelected European Commission 8] x-)
Immigration , and all the problems that come with it ( another long list ) x-) x-)
Freedom to restore Britain's customs and traditions. x-) 8(:
Freedom to Restore Britain's legal system x-) 8(:
etc etc etc

:)

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nick
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by nick » Wed May 25, 2016 6:52 pm

Much has been said about folk needing "facts" before being able to decide. There has been a load of spurious bollocks on both sides. Personally I think Cameron has been utterly despicable in his conduct following his pseudo-deal with the EU. Whatever the outcome I suspect there will be much unrest in the country afterwards, and Cameron will soon be forced to resign because there will be a vote of no confidence (even if we remain) which his 12-strong Commons majority will not survive. Good riddance!

The obvious, known facts for me are that the EU is undemocratic, wasteful, full of self-serving bureaucratic non-entities, full of hypocrites typified by Kinnock and his wife, Mandelson etc etc who have had 1st class tickets on the gravy train for years. It has led to massive unemployment, especially and tragically amongst young people, in Spain, Greece etc.

Typically the EU budgets and accounts which are reported publicly at the end of May each year have been postponed until after the UK Referendum.

I despise the political establishment so much that I doubt we would leave the EU even if the people voted OUT. My cynicism even leads me to think there is a chance that a bogus result will be called.

I can only think of one person of my acquaintance who intends to vote Remain and everyone else I know wants OUT (like me). I cannot understand why so many people on the left or centre left are so wedded to the EU project. The lack of democracy and bullying is disgusting.

9/2 to leave is tempting, particularly if I could trust the process.

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harry_rag
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by harry_rag » Wed May 25, 2016 6:58 pm

Was wondering if either of the spread firms had any markets up.

SPIN's 100 index (100 if "stay" wins, 0 for "leave") is pitched at 77-84. By my reckoning, the risk/reward on a buy or sell means you'd be better off taking the fixed odds prices available. Interestingly, they quote individual prices for each of the 4 home Nations.

At 73-80 they make Wales the most likely to favour "leave", closely followed by England at 75-82.

Scotland are regarded as the most avowed "stay" voters, with a price of 94-98, with the spread for Northern Ireland just 1 point lower.

For those of you who don't speak "spread", selling Scotland at 94 is the equivalent to almost 16/1 for Col's countrymen favouring our leaving.

Overall turnout is expected to be around 62% with 55% voting to stay.

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The Linnet
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by The Linnet » Wed May 25, 2016 7:19 pm

OUT !!!

or OUT OUT as Micky Flanagan says :thumbs

Like someone said its been a bit one sided ive only seen and read about how great it will be to stay in and how utterly shit it will be if we leave ... think its totally wrong how Cameron has spent millions of tax payers money in sending out pamphlet things to every household in the country cos its so important we know the facts , then surely its as equally important to know the true facts of coming out so they should spend more money to print and send out pamphlets for that !

I hate Cameron and his cohorts , despicable assholes the whole lot of them (and that goes for the whole political spectrum tbh) for that reason alone i'll be voting out as will everyone i know , i dont know of anyone whose actually voting to stay in but like Nick i think if the majority vote out we'll still stay in , i didnt trust the last election result and this one will be no different , its as tho they think the public cant be trusted to vote and this culture will only get worse if we stay in the EU imo

As Peanut said our history , traditions , sovereignty etc are all at stake but i fear alot of people have been brainwashed by their exposure to the mainstream media and i really do think that alot of people just follow the line like sheep (unfortunatley) and in this day and age from what i can see the majority have the mindset of 'Im alright jack fXXk you' so if they're comfortable doesnt matter whats going on around them as long as they are okay

And i agree with Fenny on the Eastern Europeans , im only up the road really and its like that here too , where i am was always a rough area but its gone tragically downhill , its depressing , they call where i am little russia , and its an absolute shithole . They have no manners , respect for us , our country or our traditions

I think if we dont get out , we should all pitch in buy an island ... Punters Paradise we could call it :thumbs
Money Is A Hoax , Debt Is Slavery , Media Is Manipulation , Religion Is Control

The System Is A Lie

Janthefish
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by Janthefish » Wed May 25, 2016 8:16 pm

Even though we'll shunned by the rest of the world and become a wasteland I'm voting 'out'. unfortunately I believe the majority will be swayed by Cameron and his cronies and play safe- then protest that 'they were conned' when we join a 'United States of Europe'.

youngvanish

Re: IN OR OUT

Post by youngvanish » Wed May 25, 2016 10:12 pm

A view which is unlikely to enhance my newcomer status, but I'm not being swayed from my commitment to vote "remain".

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The Fenman
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by The Fenman » Thu May 26, 2016 5:22 am

Well i dont know anyone apart from our newbie here :) who has said stay . . .Thought it may just be a Wisbech fing.

But obviously its not . . . Im going to have a bit on the to leave :thumbs
Keep doing right things, right things happen. . . Simple innit

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The Fenman
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by The Fenman » Thu May 26, 2016 5:28 am

I think if we dont get out , we should all pitch in buy an island ... Punters Paradise we could call it

Think col owns a few islands up the frozen north.

Saw one of them spitting in Ladbrokes bin last week.

The mangeress went nuts at him . . He said "I spit in bin not on floor"

He honestly couldnt see what he done wrong *, *, *, *,
Keep doing right things, right things happen. . . Simple innit

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Col
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by Col » Thu May 26, 2016 6:55 am

youngvanish wrote:A view which is unlikely to enhance my newcomer status, but I'm not being swayed from my commitment to vote "remain".
Welcome mate. :thumbs

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nick
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by nick » Thu May 26, 2016 8:59 am

youngvanish wrote:A view which is unlikely to enhance my newcomer status, but I'm not being swayed from my commitment to vote "remain".
Welcome :cheers .

Care to expand on your commitment to Remain and show us dinosaurs why we are so wrong?

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PlaceWinner
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by PlaceWinner » Thu May 26, 2016 10:20 am

From betting point of view....IN is a sure thing!
"This will not be beaten"

youngvanish

Re: IN OR OUT

Post by youngvanish » Thu May 26, 2016 11:14 am

nick wrote:Care to expand on your commitment to Remain and show us dinosaurs why we are so wrong?
Simply that I've yet to hear or see a valid reason for leaving. Spitting and being rude? c'mon, there'd still be plenty of that if we cleared out every non-Brit wouldn't there?

... and what does "regain our sovereignty" actually mean? e.g. why would this be better?

Am I wrong in assuming that all Brexit supporters who use sovereignty as an issue would therefore have preferred the Scots to have voted for their independence?

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peanut
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by peanut » Thu May 26, 2016 11:33 am

youngvanish wrote:
nick wrote:Care to expand on your commitment to Remain and show us dinosaurs why we are so wrong?
Simply that I've yet to hear or see a valid reason for leaving. Spitting and being rude? c'mon, there'd still be plenty of that if we cleared out every non-Brit wouldn't there?

... and what does "regain our sovereignty" actually mean? e.g. why would this be better?

Am I wrong in assuming that all Brexit supporters who use sovereignty as an issue would therefore have preferred the Scots to have voted for their independence?
Hello youngvanish :v:

Perhaps you can give us a few reasons to stay in then , as I have yet to hear any coming from the "In Team", the only reasons coming from them appears to be doom and gloom if we leave. :)

Also in answer to the Scottish question , yes if that is what the majority want.

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nick
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by nick » Thu May 26, 2016 12:21 pm

youngvanish wrote:
nick wrote:Care to expand on your commitment to Remain and show us dinosaurs why we are so wrong?
Simply that I've yet to hear or see a valid reason for leaving. Spitting and being rude? c'mon, there'd still be plenty of that if we cleared out every non-Brit wouldn't there?

... and what does "regain our sovereignty" actually mean? e.g. why would this be better?

Am I wrong in assuming that all Brexit supporters who use sovereignty as an issue would therefore have preferred the Scots to have voted for their independence?
Thanks for replying :thumbs .

As Peanut infers, no positive endorsements for the EU there, rather a contentment with the status quo.

"Regaining our sovereignty" means making our own elected parliament supreme once again in our own country in law-making and policy-making, and not being subordinate to unelected bureaucrats in Brussels and Strasbourg (why have two separate HQ's by the way - more waste and more gravy on the goodies train).

Regarding your point about Scotland, I think you are confusing England with the United Kingdom. I reckon most people in the UK want the UK to stick together - I do.

youngvanish

Re: IN OR OUT

Post by youngvanish » Thu May 26, 2016 1:28 pm

nick wrote:As Peanut infers, no positive endorsements for the EU there, rather a contentment with the status quo.
Contentment with your situation IS a positive.
"Regaining our sovereignty" means making our own elected parliament supreme once again in our own country in law-making and policy-making, and not being subordinate to unelected bureaucrats in Brussels and Strasbourg (why have two separate HQ's by the way - more waste and more gravy on the goodies train).

Regarding your point about Scotland, I think you are confusing England with the United Kingdom. I reckon most people in the UK want the UK to stick together - I do.
Substitute London for "Brussels/Strasborg" in your sovereignty statement above, and that's the main thrust of the Independence for Scotland campaign position isn't it?

peanut wrote:Perhaps you can give us a few reasons to stay in then , as I have yet to hear any coming from the "In Team", the only reasons coming from them appears to be doom and gloom if we leave. :)
I think we dig ourselves into our respective entrenched positions. You've not heard any valid reason to remain because you don't want to, you're not listening. Much like the reverse of me, I probably don't want to hear and/or believe reasons to leave.

I wasn't in favour of Scottish independence because I believed both parties would suffer because as a result. My perspective is that there is strength in numbers. As an example, Tesco are more efficient and can sell food more cheaply because of their size, if your local Tesco became an independent so as to serve the local population better and not be ruled by a faceless and remote head office, both they and the local population would pay the price of such a self-governing move. (I'm not a Tesco fan and rarely use their stores, but the model is simple enough to understand)

The UK has more clout being part of the EU. Google, Facebook, etc yielded to pressure from this large trading bloc for the payment of taxes, whereas if it were the UK standing alone wagging a finger ~ would anyone have taken any notice?

Strength in numbers, national trade unions have muscle, single workplace unions have little influence by comparison. Why throw away a position of strength?

Finally, if I traded being governed by Brussels for the 'sovereignty' of being governed solely by a Tory party I didn't vote for, from a base over 100 miles away from where I live, forgive me if I can't see a benefit.

youngvanish

Re: IN OR OUT

Post by youngvanish » Thu May 26, 2016 1:30 pm

. . . and I thought I joined a betting forum *,

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Col
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by Col » Thu May 26, 2016 1:37 pm

youngvanish wrote:. . . and I thought I joined a betting forum *,
You obviously haven't read our brickies thread yet :lol

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peanut
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by peanut » Thu May 26, 2016 1:39 pm

Noe the wiser from your reply youngvanih , you do seem to edge around the subject. Are you a plant from our beloved goverment as you do sound like a politician. 8]

If you are happy to watch our standard of living drop ,wages lowered and no future for your children as we slowly sink into the sea due to an infrastructure that is totally unable to cope with the rise in population, then God help us all *,

To hell in a hand cart comes to mind. :)

youngvanish

Re: IN OR OUT

Post by youngvanish » Thu May 26, 2016 1:46 pm

peanut wrote:If you are happy to watch our standard of living drop ,wages lowered and no future for your children as we slowly sink into the sea due to an infrastructure that is totally unable to cope with the rise in population, then God help us all *,

To hell in a hand cart comes to mind. :)
Is this going to happen, is happening now, or has happened already? ... and all because of the EU?

I love to be given some examples.

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peanut
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by peanut » Thu May 26, 2016 1:49 pm

A big Yes to your questions :thumbs

Still awaiting your examples :cheers

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nick
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by nick » Thu May 26, 2016 2:08 pm

Youngvanish, you seem to think our parliament in London is as undemocratic as the duplicates in Strasbourg and Brussels {:( .

It was you who brought in the Scottish referendum.

The UK seems to have little clout within the EU. They want our money not our ideas. I feel your approach is entirely defeatist, but of course we come from different generations.

Look forward to you putting up some bets on this betting forum for us grumpies to consider ;-) .

youngvanish

Re: IN OR OUT

Post by youngvanish » Thu May 26, 2016 3:49 pm

nick wrote:... but of course we come from different generations.
Why "of course"?

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nick
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by nick » Thu May 26, 2016 4:09 pm

youngvanish wrote:
Contentment with your situation IS a positive.

Substitute London for "Brussels/Strasborg" in your sovereignty statement above, and that's the main thrust of the Independence for Scotland campaign position isn't it?

I think we dig ourselves into our respective entrenched positions. You've not heard any valid reason to remain because you don't want to, you're not listening. Much like the reverse of me, I probably don't want to hear and/or believe reasons to leave.

As an example, Tesco are more efficient and can sell food more cheaply because of their size, if your local Tesco became an independent so as to serve the local population better and not be ruled by a faceless and remote head office, both they and the local population would pay the price of such a self-governing move.

Finally, if I traded being governed by Brussels for the 'sovereignty' of being governed solely by a Tory party I didn't vote for, from a base over 100 miles away from where I live, forgive me if I can't see a benefit.
Those statements led me to conclude we are from different generations.

How old are you?

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harry_rag
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by harry_rag » Thu May 26, 2016 4:38 pm

Nick is 102 by the way. ;-)

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nick
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by nick » Thu May 26, 2016 4:46 pm

I don't take offence because Harry and I have been friends since he used to lubricate the propellers of my Spitfire before I took off after the beastly Hun ;-) .

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The Fenman
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by The Fenman » Thu May 26, 2016 4:49 pm

Col wrote:
youngvanish wrote:. . . and I thought I joined a betting forum *,
You obviously haven't read our brickies thread yet :lol


;x; ;x; ;x; ;x; ;x; ;x;
Keep doing right things, right things happen. . . Simple innit

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The Fenman
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Re: IN OR OUT

Post by The Fenman » Thu May 26, 2016 5:14 pm

Simply that I've yet to hear or see a valid reason for leaving. Spitting and being rude? c'mon, there'd still be plenty of that if we cleared out every non-Brit wouldn't there?

come have a night down norfolk street in wiso youngvanish x-) x-)
Keep doing right things, right things happen. . . Simple innit

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